Should the USA split up?

Ahmed IV wrote:Well to invade the US it would have to have a stronger military. ALso the US's militray atm is weka from Afghnaistan and Iraq.

do you have any evidence of this?

[to the above] Obama is fixing the fact that our military is in Iraq and Afghanistan. He's withdrawing lots of soldiers.

He is actually putting in more soldiers, Ahmed. That way, "they can get out quicker". yeah right!


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25676250/


http://blogs.wsj.com/capitaljournal/2009/03/10/perilous-path-obama-risks-losing-core-supporters-with-afghanistan-strategy/

That was... Unexpected

no, he said that in his policy when he was running for president. It was just not publicized. (for obvious reason)

Yea... I can see why

Bad publicity LOL

exactly..we only let out what we want to...

Actually, it might have not made too much of a difference

Republicans would have voted for him

perhaps not...but moving on, do you think the party system divides US?

No it does not...it makes the US more diverse.

diverse...but the tensions between the parties, and the questioning over a two party system in the first place, does that create social barriers?

Well whether they should is sort of the decision of the people isn't it. currently, I don't think they plan on doing just that, seeing as there is great optimism on the new U.S administration and the democratic process.

In theory, I doubt it will ever happen or could happen in normal circumstance really. The people of the country are in a state of mind where they actually prefer the Unity of a union. We have seen this in the U.S's foundation when it states in the constitution...

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect
Union, establish Justice, ensure domestic Tranquility, provide for the
common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings
of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this
Constitution for the United States of America.

And we also saw this during the civil war when any attempt of succession was crushed. So really, i seee no reason for the U.S to even split, let alone how it could be achieved.

Phoenix Rider wrote:Well whether they should is sort of the decision of the people isn't it. currently, I don't think they plan on doing just that, seeing as there is great optimism on the new U.S administration and the democratic process.

In theory, I doubt it will ever happen or could happen in normal circumstance really. The people of the country are in a state of mind where they actually prefer the Unity of a union. We have seen this in the U.S's foundation when it states in the constitution...

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect
Union, establish Justice, ensure domestic Tranquility, provide for the
common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings
of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this
Constitution for the United States of America.

And we also saw this during the civil war when any attempt of succession was crushed. So really, i seee no reason for the U.S to even split, let alone how it could be achieved.

Well they tried splitting before...also the union might not be so lucky this time.

I heard that California wants to be a seperate country.

Yes, but i see no reason in them doing so? Wat have they to gain when it's that unity that gives them so much strength? They command a entire nation spanning from the Pacific to the Atlantic. Literally half a continent. Using that they have managed to harness the resources of the surroundings and the people to build the Empire u see today.

So the question is Ahmed, why should they? And how could they? The United States military is committed in serving only the President in Washington. Any act of rebellion can easily be crushed. Wat political party or ideology is strong enough to force a schism? It's simply impossible under normal circumstances.

Also, California? U have a better chance of Alaska splitting the California. Facts Ahmed. Sources. Where are they? So far, I see no major succession or independent party gaining momentum in their democratic system. So without military or political support, I see no chance of a succession happening.

Phoenix Rider wrote:Yes, but i see no reason in them doing so? Wat have they to gain when it's that unity that gives them so much strength? They command a entire nation spanning from the Pacific to the Atlantic. Literally half a continent. Using that they have managed to harness the resources of the surroundings and the people to build the Empire u see today.

So the question is Ahmed, why should they? And how could they? The United States military is committed in serving only the President in Washington. Any act of rebellion can easily be crushed. Wat political party or ideology is strong enough to force a schism? It's simply impossible under normal circumstances.

Also, California? U have a better chance of Alaska splitting the California. Facts Ahmed. Sources. Where are they? So far, I see no major succession or independent party gaining momentum in their democratic system. So without military or political support, I see no chance of a succession happening.

They should because that empire is collapsing, if you hadn't noticed. It would make sense that California splits since it is the richest state in the US. The rest of the states are just a burden if you know what I mean.

Its not a matter of how far it is (Alsaka being far), rather its a matter of how the state is dependent on the rest of the states, that keeps them unified.

Wouldn't that be the people's choice then? So far, I see no real threat to the unity of their nation. There is no real or major call for succession and I doubt their people will ever agree to such a move. The military can easily crush a rebellion and i doubt any succession movement can muster a force like that in the Civil War.

Also, where was the proof I asked for Ahmed? Give me a link or news article stating that a massive amount of Californians wish to separate from the Union?

the U.S. splitting up is a disaster move, since it is making it easy for a rival country to attack and conquer the area.

Phoenix Rider wrote:Wouldn't that be the people's choice then? So far, I see no real threat to the unity of their nation. There is no real or major call for succession and I doubt their people will ever agree to such a move. The military can easily crush a rebellion and i doubt any succession movement can muster a force like that in the Civil War.

Also, where was the proof I asked for Ahmed? Give me a link or news article stating that a massive amount of Californians wish to separate from the Union?

So you dont see the massive debt as a "real threat"?

Don't you think that if a part of the US wants to split...it will aslo ahev a miliatray...both at the end make up the US army.

I read it before...I don't remember where

Yes, but it is inconceivable how something of that sort can be done Ahmed. I see no scenario in which a state or confederacy in modern times, under normal circumstances can achieve such a split. It's silly to think about it when u urself have no idea how it can be done.

The Americans have just exercised their democratic right by electing a new president. Satisfaction for Obama is about 66-68%. There is no threat to the government, no real reason to disrupt national unity.

Wat u are doing Ahmed is flinging scenarios at me, hoping one could hit and work without actually thinking about it. U say debt. Tell me more! They have a new economic stimulus plan that most Americans seem to agree with. Also, so what? U haven't gone into detail to say how it can affect unity. U say California. Tell me, how can California break away from the rest of the Union with the military more than capable to seize it back again?

Really Ahmed, go into more detail here.

Phoenix Rider wrote:

The Americans have just exercised their democratic right by electing a new president. Satisfaction for Obama is about 66-68%. There is no threat to the government, no real reason to disrupt national unity.

Really? Last time I heard, Obama has a very high chance of being assinated for sort of obvious reasons. (Hint: KKK)

Wat u are doing Ahmed is flinging scenarios at me, hoping one could hit and work without actually thinking about it. U say debt. Tell me more! They have a new economic stimulus plan that most Americans seem to agree with. Also, so what? U haven't gone into detail to say how it can affect unity. U say California. Tell me, how can California break away from the rest of the Union with the military more than capable to seize it back again?

The debt is larger then all of the world's debt combined! All that stimulus nonsense will not work. Its all, sort of, a bread and circuses policy that was used in the times of the Romans.

How do you knoe that the rest of the states will back the union?

Buddy, the Klan? U think that's wat's going to take out Obama? A group of racists with no real organizational structure, scattered throughout the United States and monitored by the FBI? Don't make me laugh! They simply have no manpower or capability to take out the President of the world's most powerful country.

Also, wat u have failed to mention is a scenario in which a succession is achievabe. U keep mentioning California. buddy, California has a $15 Billion annual deficit. That's expected to rise to 20 Billion next year. It's economy is reliant on heavy domestic trade with the rest of the United States. A succesion will drive them to the poor house and unless they see economic assistance from the Federal government, they can look forward to the same. Unemployment is on 10% in LA, Bussinesses from the Film Industry to Fashion Retail are shutting. Do u expect them to be capable of independance at this rate? Learn ur facts buddy!

Phoenix Rider wrote:Buddy, the Klan? U think that's wat's going to take out Obama? A group of racists with no real organizational structure, scattered throughout the United States and monitored by the FBI? Don't make me laugh! They simply have no manpower or capability to take out the President of the world's most powerful country.

Also, wat u have failed to mention is a scenario in which a succession is achievabe. U keep mentioning California. buddy, California has a $15 Billion annual deficit. That's expected to rise to 20 Billion next year. It's economy is reliant on heavy domestic trade with the rest of the United States. A succesion will drive them to the poor house and unless they see economic assistance from the Federal government, they can look forward to the same. Unemployment is on 10% in LA, Bussinesses from the Film Industry to Fashion Retail are shutting. Do u expect them to be capable of independance at this rate? Learn ur facts buddy!

You call an organization that has been formed since decades ago unorganized?! Trust me they do, they sill have power, if you didn't know. But don't believe me...time will tell you.

NOTE: FYI, did you see the car that Obama rode in to his inoguration (sp?)? That is the care with the most security features ever made. Also he is the president with the ihighest security.

Well California, the richest US state, has become bankrupt...do you know what that means? That means tha corruption will rise, and the central power will weaken. After that succession might happen.

U and ur fearmongering. It's funny.

Back to topic.

U admit urself that Obama has the highest security achievable by the United States. (World's most strongest Nation BTW. *Nudge* *Nudge* Need I say more?) Now how do u propose a bunch of Rednecks from rural America, probably being monitored by the FBI, form a plan assassination plan cunning enough to kill the president, travel to Washington DC with the men and arms needed, get passed the FBI...CIA...Secret Service...ETC, and get a chance to target Obama? How can u even concieve this? It's crazy to even think it.

Also, back to succesion, again u throw scenarious at me that have no basis or prooof to back it up. Plz, sopply me with sources and actual facts to support ur argument. How can u say that just because California is bankrupt, corruption can rise? Whereare the statistics? Really Ahmed, u should do urself more justice than this. How can a rise in corruption form a succesion movement powerful enough to rival Washington?

*Cough* It used to be the world's stongest *cough* , you need to really keep up with the news.

Guess what, Obama's firs assissnation attempt came from Turkey (When he went there last week). Even if the KKK don't do it, he has a very high chance of beign assissnated by who ever.

California is Bankrupt

Well its sort of logical that corruption follows bankruptcy. Bankruptcy means people lose jobs. No jobs means no money. No money means no lviing. So you tell me...

There has been assassinations before. Did that compromise their unity? There has been economic depressions far worst than this (Great Depression) but did that compromise their unity? History has thought us Ahmed that such these things aren't enough to hurl that Nation into anarchy.